Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#1 by Tom Photiou , Mon Feb 05, 2018 9:44 pm

What can i say about this film?
What a fantastic title to come my way. It was purchased from a fellow collector and is an LPP polyester print and supplied in a mini suitcase.
The image is pin sharp and the image itself is fantastic. The sound, as always on 16, is first class doing full justice to that brilliant John Barry soundtrack. This print has some cinch marks on reel one and the odd line at the first ten minutes of reel two but as 90% of the movie is set against fantastic landscape and daytime the marks are, in our opinion, nothing to distract the viewer from this stunning movie. I feel very lucky to own this movie, yes if it was scope it would be even better but when we viewed it tonight we never even gave that a thought. A first class film and supplied on 5 1600ft spools i am more than happy to leave it this way, as Mats said before, i dont mind the breaks, i love my cups of tea This one, like Witness, is a 10 out of 10. Aside that, if i want to serialise this over a couple of evenings its perfect.
These images are only from reels one and two as after this i just wanted to watch the movie.
As always, these images do not do it any justice, this is a sharp as i can get them using the old digi camera that i use.

From the novel by Michael Blake,
Dances with Wolves is a 1990 American epic Western film starring, directed and produced by Kevin Costner. It is a film adaptation of the 1988 book of the same name by Blake that tells the story of a Union Army lieutenant who travels to the American frontier to find a military post, and of his dealings with a group of Lakota Indians.
Costner developed the film with an initial budget of $15 million. Dances with Wolves had high production values and won seven Academy Awards including Best Picture and the Golden Globe Award for Best Motion Picture Drama. Much of the dialogue is spoken in Lakota with English subtitles. It was shot in South Dakota and Wyoming, and translated by Albert White Hat, the chair of the Lakota Studies Department at Sinte Gleska University.
The film is credited as a leading influence for the revitalisation of the Western genre of filmmaking in Hollywood. In 2007, Dances with Wolves was selected for preservation in the United States National Film Registry by the Library of Congress as being "culturally, historically, or aesthetically significant"


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#2 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Mon Feb 05, 2018 9:54 pm

That is a first class top titled print you have there Tom.
I can fully understand your unmistakable brimming pride in landing it.
It's an absolute beauty mate!


"C'Mon Baggy, Get With The Beat"


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#3 by Tom Photiou , Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:08 pm

Thanks Andrew, it certainly is, as you know i will only be able to have a modest size collection of 16 so i want to ensure the movies, (excluding the Television episodes), we choose are all good titles and good non fading prints. I think you once used the term, quality not quantity, and for our 16s this will be a must
This one, as all the titles we have was a one off offer and if i had passed it by i just know that i would always regret it, (i knew about the marks on the first few reels, the movie is exactly as described when offered & with Jagged Edge to view when i get it given to me for my Birthday i look forward to whats next. I do wish i had a sneaky peek before having to hand it over for wrapping


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#4 by Robert Crewdson ( deleted ) , Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:09 pm

Excellent screenshots as usual Tom, and beautiful colour. You have been very fortunate with your 16mm collecting; getting titles you want, and in great condition and colour.



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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#5 by Vidar Olavesen , Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:11 pm

Damn, envious ;-) Looks superb ... Think of me if you want to sell sometime


 
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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#6 by Tom Photiou , Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:12 pm

Thank you Robert, yes i have been very fortunate so far, we only have 11 features at present, but if i include the TV programmes its 23, so if i cheat and say i want up to 30 features that means i still have 19 to go
Now all i need is someone to let me know what they have for sale, David????????

Vidar, thank you, you may be waiting a long time though.


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#7 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:23 pm

The beauty with 16mm film is there is an overwhelming amount of choice.

The only drawback with 16mm film is there is an overwhelming amount of choice!

Ouch.. says the bank manager every month. 😁😁

The temptation to go completely mad must be enormous at times and if you can limit yourself to 30 films Tom,with titles like this surfacing for you, ... then I will eat my hat! :)))


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#8 by Tom Photiou , Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:31 pm

i will have to try Andy, mainly for the room and the fact im nearly 56 so starting this late in a collecting life is a bit daft, i need to have an amount i can re-watch occasionally, after all we do have a large super 8 collection as well. there is only so many films one can realisticly keep and view as well as actually live
How you blokes with thousands of films get round to viewing them is beyond me. To pay hundreds for a film only to view once in a blue moon is just mad.


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#9 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:38 pm

I completely agree with you there Tom and no more so than with your parting statement there.

It is one reason why I'm already thinking along the lines of if any more, then it will have to be under a strict one in, one out ruling.

As hard as it is to let go the things we collect and treasure, there will only ever be 24 hours in any given day and as I get older, it feels like a whole lot less.

At one time not so far back, I couldn't say that I was ever sat on any film that had cost me handsomely for any length of time without then viewing and enjoying it all over again, but annoyingly now, it is regretfully fast becoming the case.


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#10 by Mark Mander ( deleted ) , Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:15 pm

Looks great Tom, nice screenshots too,well done on picking this one up,Mark


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#11 by Robert Crewdson ( deleted ) , Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:24 pm

Tom, I was 53 when I got into 16mm, and reach official retirement age this year. I've had to stop now, due to space, plus, i've got enough of both guages to keep me occupied. 2017 has been the best ever year for me in film buying; eleven features, including several that I have always wanted to own. I'm resisting looking on Ebay and other sites, otherwise, I might see something I just have to own.



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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#12 by Tom Photiou , Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:28 pm

Thanks Mark, this 16mm has certainly revitalised my faith in cine collecting, much more affordable,(except for the very top titles of course), having to pay 200 and up for features on 8 was becoming a bit depressing. still lots i want on 8 but i think if they come up on 16 they will be cheaper by far and if they are 80s they will be likely to be on agfa or lpp so quality is almost assured.


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#13 by Mark Mander ( deleted ) , Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:37 pm

Just buy to watch Tom and not buy to collect and you'll keep a grip on things, it's too tempting to just keep filling shelves with films you'll one day get round to projecting but where's the fun in that,Mark


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#14 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:42 am

It's a brilliant way to remain active within what can be a very expensive hobby at times and it virtually guarantees that no matter what life throws our way, we could all have some part to play in this hobby after an initial outlay.

The only thing I'd find personally frustrating adopting this policy, is when you just fancy watching a particular title on any given day, that may well be the time you don't have it any longer.

I see some individuals buying and selling equipment and films on an almost daily basis while trying always to balance their books with the everyday expenses of general living.
To have good equipment or film, then only to have to lose them again to then search again for the very same thing one month later, would really drive me insane personally.

Plus nowadays it would be harder and harder to ever be able to guarantee this now things are becoming a little scarce.


"C'Mon Baggy, Get With The Beat"


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#15 by Tom Photiou , Tue Feb 06, 2018 8:29 am

Thats true Andy. These days i try and make my hobby self funding. 8mm has been my main hobby all my working life since i was 16 and obviously this gauge is an easy one to collect. An average wardrobe can hold dozens or hundruds of titles if you collect shorts and features.
The 16mm we have now does take up a shelf with a handful of titles. It is purely because i have a dedicated room, in fact a whole lower ground area, that i was able to consider 16. This gauge is one you caould rotate the buying and selling in order to keep watching new.
I wont need to do this in my middle age years as super top titles on 16 that will cost three,four hundrud upward will simply not be considered. I always said i will never pay ridicilous cash for what is a movie within a hobby. Should i ever win the lotto i may spend up toward 300 350 but even then i have learned the value of money and im not that stupid to put a grand on watching a film4. The titles i have got so far prove you dont need to be scilly.
This particular film reviewed is one i never thought would end up in our collection.


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#16 by Mark Mander ( deleted ) , Tue Feb 06, 2018 9:02 am

I don't mean buy to watch and sell it,I mean buy something on 16mm you really want instead of buying to collect all sorts of films that wouldn't watch, we've all been there,Mark


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#17 by Tom Photiou , Tue Feb 06, 2018 9:58 am

Sorry mark i se what u mean. Yes 100% agree with you on that. 16mm will definatly be just that. Those historical films we have, waterloo, cromwell and kidnapped, (sort of historical ) were all very much what we wanted. Cross of iron is one of our favourite war films witness is one of mine as is this film reviewed here. The collection we end up with will all be wanted titles.


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#18 by Del Phillipson , Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:17 am

Wow Tom, just wow, that is an incredible picture, chomping at the bit to get my TQ111 now.


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#19 by Tom Photiou , Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:12 pm

Thank you dell. Let us know when your up and running. Im loving this stuff.i left it 20 years later than i should have done.


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#20 by Barry Attwood ( deleted ) , Tue Feb 06, 2018 1:14 pm

There was talk of Kempski bringing this out on 8mm in Scope, first I heard it was going to be F/L then an edited version (2x600'), but this was near the end of the life of the company before Derek at Derann did a deal for his negs, what a shame, just looking at Tom's fantastic 16mm panned and scanned print is stunning, what would it have looked like in Scope on 8mm (even an edited print!).


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#21 by Tom Photiou , Tue Feb 06, 2018 1:30 pm

I once saw a scope 16mm print for sale many years ago, i will look at my derann sales lists as i am sure its on one of them, back then it was ,(i think) 500 quid but that was days when the average 16mm film seem to be between 50 and 200 max so 500 was a lot but at that time the film was only a few years old. Although this one is 4:3 i have to say you dont see any panning like you normally do, in fact now you mention it i didn't see any panning at all. I will take a closer look next time, i was a wee bit taken back at how good this print is to look at. Up until i got back into 16 i was under the impression that most 16mm films were pretty worn or cut up but i have to say how wrong i was. Of course there is a lot of junk out there, we see that all the time,but sticking to reliable sources the fact is there is so much more on this gauge and if you stick with Agfa or LPP i dont think you can go wrong.
A 2 x 600ft release on 8 would have been a great seller im sure especially if it was on Agfa or LPP.


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#22 by Robert Crewdson ( deleted ) , Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:23 pm

Going back to the 70s Tom, some of the pre-print material of Super 8 was not always the best; scratchy prints. I have had a number of 16mm films that are better than the Super 8 stuff we bought new. When I got into it, I didn't know what to expect, so I was surprised to find that some of these prints look like they have just come from the labs, and never owned by any other party.



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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#23 by Tom Photiou , Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:33 pm

And thats what i am finding now Robert, The later 80s 8mm films seemed to improve dramatically but from what i can see so far the 16mm items, no matter the era, all seem to be sharpe with excellent sound. The rest of course is how previous people looked after them,


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#24 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Wed Feb 07, 2018 12:35 pm

Once I'd seen it was Kevin who had sold you this film Tom, everything fell into place for me.

I know Kevin would have only charged you an extremely fair price for what is an outstanding film in both quality terms as well as desirability terms.
It is these that many would start off at say £300 -500 asking price when as good as this.
Not Kevin.
Consistently I've heard him say to myself in similar circumstances, I am happy to just receive what I paid for the film so long as I know genuine keen COLLECTORS are receiving the prints.

I got similar outstanding good fortune receiving COCOON on Super 8mm from him and only last month I received 3 outstanding low fade features all in superb shape from him and he has even allowed me to pay for two once I get paid in February!
Not a one did he charge me anything like what he could have received for them had he placed them onto the auction site.

That is what you are dealing with if you are fortunate enough to be quick enough to land anything at all that Kevin is ever parting with.

You know it is consistently first class goods, often never to be found elsewhere for anything other than ridiculously high price points, and anything Kevin has ever owned and is prepared to sell will always be in outstanding condition to boot!

What a guy!

From this time period onwards, quite besides all else, I will always remain completely mindful and very much indebted to Kevin for having the lasting memory that is was HE and he alone who finally allowed me to complete my treasured collection of Derann Disney Super 8mm features.
Thank you once again Mr Clark, from the bottom of my heart.


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RE: Dances With Wolves theatrical version.

#25 by Alan Rik , Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:21 am

I love this film as well. I forced an ex of mine to go see the extended version. My favorite part was looking over to see her sleeping. Haha!
But I personally think its a great film. It really moved me. I wonder if they ever released that in scope? The old frontier would look great in that format but getting it in any format is a score! :)


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