Sound bars

#1 by Vidar Olavesen , Wed Sep 30, 2015 1:30 pm

I wonder if a newer type sound bar would be useable with Elmo ST-1200? My speaker is taken from a B&H and isn't very powerful. Would be nice with a little more punch and less rattling :-)


 
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RE: Sound bars

#2 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 3:28 pm

Someone will know better than I Vidar, but hi-fi speakers etc tend to amplify all the wrong noises like hiss and hum
from projectors. I think it was the late Ivan Watson, well respected scribe from "Movie Maker" magazine, said that
a general rule of thumb being the bigger the magnet in the speaker, the better it was for sound from cine, of course
you must make sure it is the right power, either 8 ohm or 16 ohm for your projector.



Hugh Thompson Scott
Last edited Wed Sep 30, 2015 3:28 pm | Top

RE: Sound bars

#3 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 10:56 pm

A sound bar on the end of a ST 1200 would be the equivalent of partnering a HMV gramaphone with a pair of Kef Refence speakers or a Linn Sondek partnered with a set of binatone speakers.

An absolute complete sonic calamity and in short....a total mismatch in every sense of the word.



Andrew Woodcock
Last edited Wed Sep 30, 2015 10:58 pm | Top

RE: Sound bars

#4 by Vidar Olavesen , Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:05 pm

You got a better suggestion for me? The small speaker has no bass, need to use full treble or it "rattles" ... Would like something that can take a little more punch.

Thanks, I haven't bought any yet luckily


 
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RE: Sound bars

#5 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:22 pm

Vidar, what you need is a very good amplifier and speaker set from the very same era the projector was made in.

Today's equipment is made to handle frequencies never seen in a bygone era and today's sensitive tweeters would be damaged in minutes with all that snap, crackle & pop!.
Their sensitivity range is far too refined for our vintage equipment.
They really are designed, dare I say, for only today's digital equipment.

A good 70's integrated amplifier coupled with say a pair of Craven speakers would work well for what you trying to achieve.
Bass isn't as sensitive to change over the years so if it's just bass you're chasing, try adding a decent yamaha subwoofer (for example) on the end of a aging pro logic 3:1 set up with 70's or 80's speakers.
Jamo made some decent ones in the 80's that are bass heavy as did Mission.



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Andrew Woodcock
Last edited Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:25 pm | Top

RE: Sound bars

#6 by Steve Carter ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:23 pm

I think a 10 or 12 inch guitar amp speaker fits the bill, I was going to try my monitor out on the DCT through an old combo amp I have which has a 10" celestion speaker in it, or I may just use the speaker out straight to the 10", I will let you know Vidar.


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RE: Sound bars

#7 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:27 pm

Yes I agree Steve, so long as no piezoelectric horn is fitted
They are awful for refined sound. Ok for PA from afar but that's it

As you say, celestion, Mission, Craven, Ohm... they are all decent.

To name but a few.

It's a case of bringing to the forefront the frequencies you want to while keeping at bay those you don't.

We arn t talking audiophile quality here, just something entirely suitable.



Andrew Woodcock
Last edited Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:32 pm | Top

RE: Sound bars

#8 by Steve Carter ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:31 pm

No horns or tweeters in a guitar amp Andrew just a very heavy full range speaker just like those big speakers from way back when.I have an old 8" Fender speaker, for a small speaker it packs a lot of punch, they were designed for tube amps.



Steve Carter
Last edited Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:34 pm | Top

RE: Sound bars

#9 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:34 pm

Tell me about it Steve!! I was carting 2x 18" JBL bins up two or three flights of stairs 3 times a week up until getting back into this barmy loveable hobby!!

The EV powered range of today's era are subline. 1250w rms out of a 15" full range cab!! Just Superb!!

Vidar, you should listen to a sub satellite pair of small powered EVs. They may work for you very well especially as you do outdoor larger events.
Very forgiving on shall we say...less than perfect inputs. Also excellent bass from even small 12" 300 series bins!

Mackies are also very good speakers on a professional PA level.



Andrew Woodcock
Last edited Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:52 pm | Top

RE: Sound bars

#10 by Steve Carter ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:41 pm

Been there got the t shirt Andrew, I miss playing, but I don't miss travelling, setting up and break down after a gig.


Steve Carter

RE: Sound bars

#11 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:44 pm

I know you have Steve! Happy days eh..

You gotta live a bit before you bother to spend the rest of your time half dead. That's my motto anyhow and believe me I have burned it at both ends as I'm sure you have Steve!

We all loved and remember the fun parts of performing, but as you say,pulling it all down again and packing it into a transit at 4am is no joke!



Andrew Woodcock
Last edited Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:54 pm | Top

RE: Sound bars

#12 by Steve Carter ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:48 pm

It must have been good, cause I can't remember half of it.


Steve Carter

RE: Sound bars

#13 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:49 pm

Ha ha ha. Don't you just love that neon haze of a thing we call memories!


Andrew Woodcock

RE: Sound bars

#14 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:00 am

Paul on here is our current resident expert on such matters. Hopefully he can advise you also Vidar. Especially if your set up is to be used on a larger scale to an outdoor audience say?


Andrew Woodcock

RE: Sound bars

#15 by Paul Browning , Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:02 am

I'm not sure what you hope to achieve here Vidar, your limited with the sound level out of super 8 projectors anyway, maybe come out the pre amp out into an small amp that
matches a full range speaker would do better. The figure to look at is the sensitivity of the power in to power out, 1watt of input equals so many db output. Anything that's
at least 100 db for 1 watt in is loud !!!!. If you take a well know Bose 802, these are excellent for vocal pa and rated at 250watts per cabinet, but if you look at there
sensitivity 1 watt of input produces only 89db of sound pressure level, if I remember correctly 3db increase in power is twice the volume !!!!!. So you need a big powerful
amplifier to drive them. So the higher the db out for 1 watt of power in, gives you more volume for a less powerful amplifier. The cabinets its in also helps project the sound
forward, you can buy a cheapo powered speaker for not too much money you plug in to that as some of these will cater for different impedance's( resistance's ) which may
get you a good match with the output of your projector.


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RE: Sound bars

#16 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:05 am

Told ya! Ha ha.;)) thanks Paul.


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RE: Sound bars

#17 by Paul Browning , Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:14 am

I had the gs 1200 going full tilt Andrew for an Halloween gig last year, that's supposedly 15watts a side, you couldn't here it, even through the matching Elmo speakers !!!,
what a let down, so I plugged it into the nexo system I had rigged up, er we went back to the future at lightening speed. Vidar it can be done, you need to experiment really.


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RE: Sound bars

#18 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:16 am

Vidar, there is a great little speaker on ebay now, a Craven 20 watt, I think its the same one I use. A solid piece of kit, very rugged
and nice noises come out of it, the ones you want to hear, I have been using mine for 38 years and its still banging away and no cone rattle.



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RE: Sound bars

#19 by Vidar Olavesen , Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:45 am

Wenn Sie hier auf Links zu eBay klicken und einen Kauf tätigen, kann dies dazu führen, dass diese Website eine Provision erhält.

Thanks, can't find it though on eBay. Was it expensive?


 
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RE: Sound bars

#20 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:55 am

Prey tell Hugh? These arn t seen too often nowadays.
How about a link for Vidar, Hugh?


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RE: Sound bars

#21 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Thu Oct 01, 2015 1:28 am

Hi lads, I haven't a clue how to do links, but have sent Vidar the item number in email, its 4-8 ohm 20 watts and
it is a superb little speaker, it is a companion to my Craven amp, which I only use with the Eumigs for a bit of tone control.
The person selling this asks £8.00 postage UK, so it'll be more for overseas buyers.



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Hugh Thompson Scott

RE: Sound bars

#22 by Vidar Olavesen , Thu Oct 01, 2015 1:42 am

Do not ship to Norway :-(


 
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RE: Sound bars

#23 by Andrew Woodcock ( deleted ) , Thu Oct 01, 2015 1:42 am

Yes I've just found it Hugh!
It's a fabulous example still having original box and styrene inserts!

If it were a pair, I'd be in for them myself if Vidar turned them down.

I'd feel short changed sadly having only one of these especially as I'd never find another as good to match.

I reckon given the era and quality of these, they'd be an ideal match for the Beaulieu.
After all that's what the previous owner choose to run it through in his dedicated home cinema.

Do you want it Vidar? It won't be cheap but I could send it to you if you want me to buy it first?
Looks quite large and heavy though. Just let me know Vidar please.



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Last edited Thu Oct 01, 2015 1:44 am | Top

RE: Sound bars

#24 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Thu Oct 01, 2015 3:07 am

If he wants , I too can "nail" it for him, although I've no idea what carriage will be, couriers tend to be cheaper though. Speed is of the essence though, that's why I didn't want to put the number up in case someone else jumped in and got it.



Hugh Thompson Scott

RE: Sound bars

#25 by Vidar Olavesen , Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:02 am

I would love to have it if it's still available. Thanks both of you


 
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