Not only stickers, but marker pen. That´s a shame on OB´s in good condition

Yes well said Mats. I'd completely forgotten about the ones doodled upon by a permanent marker!

Sounds like those Able Labels that will destroy your original box. If Phil checks each film, then you would wonder how our old friend Hugh Scott has had so many problems with films from them; like a copy of Hercules, advertised as Steve Reeves, turned out be a the Lou Ferrigno remake, or a copy of 'The Wild Geese', with many of the key scenes missing: in fact this one was so bad that Phil refunded the money and didn't want the print back.

I can understand, that most dealers, don´t have the time to check all prints from start to end. But as you wrote Robert, Phil refunds payment if the print is bad. I received a cartoon faded to red, and he gave me full credit, without returning it

Phil very rarely checks films and sends out some right old shite at times,even worse at Film conventions where you do take your chances,I think he looks at a few feet up to the light, he's not alone there though,why send out crap and then offer a refund when it's not accepted by the buyer,It's just so much messing about,Mark

Checking a few feet or even the first spool, doesn't tell you what the rest of the film is like. Originally, I didn't check the films, I thought that had already been done, by other sellers, only to find that an expensive film has missing perforations and jumps the loop. The reply of the vendor was 'It ran OK on my machine'. if it won't run on a B&H with 3 pull down claws, I don't see how it can be projected with any issues unnoticed on a projector with 2 pull down claws. Maybe some of these sellers hope that you will consider it too much hassle to reparcel it and pay the return postage. I got a very nice print from a US seller, but on arrival it was found to have VS, even though the sellers listings frequently say 'No VS'. When I contacted him he just said sorry, then said that he knows it would be an inconvenience for me to return it, so maybe I would like to keep it and use a cleaner to mask the VS smell. Masking it won't cure it. I still have the print, and apart from that issue, it's one of the sharpest prints I've seen, with crystal clear sound.

I have wondered if sellers watch the film before advertising, as so many seem as though they were never cleaned or lubricated in their life. Running a dry print is very risky.

I always watch a film all the way through from start to finish be for i sell it unless stated otherwise.its the only way.and yes ive had sone right crap from so called dealers who i avoid now and vs film is only fit for the bin...

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Anything i sell is always viewed from start to finish, and all our films are treated with filmguard, like Nigel i dont tend to get any problems and if there is a fault or lines, splices etc, just make sure its listed as such. As already said, films are an expensive hobby, there's a few things i do not like from any seller be they dealer or private, films described as good colour when there's fade, films described as perfect print which when received is the case for the first reel then find the rest of the film has faults, collectors being asked to send a wants list, only to see the titles being offered on a sales list or ebay. Whats the point of that then?
Other than that i am happy

I think it's true that a lot of sellers, including dealers, do not run films all through, particularly longer films such as features. I've noticed that problems with buying prints have increased over the years.

I know people here have said that its understandable that a dealer cannot possibly view all that they sell, but I don't necessarily agree I think.

These days we aren't talking hundreds of prints per week flying off the shelves typically and all dealers will confess to being enthusiasts of the hobby themselves, so why can't we expect each to viewed all the way through just for peace of mind and to give a full assessment of what they are actually attempting to sell?

How can anyone grade a print accurately or price a print accordingly if you haven't viewed it all the way through?

How would you know if an individual had themselves damaged a returned print if you didn't know of it's condition originally?

Fully agree with that Andrew; I thought Phil and others would spend their evenings watching a print, then they can price it accordingly after.

I had one film sent from a dealer only last year, full of splices,colour faded,parts missing and no ending,got a replacement print sent,splicey and colour fade but did have an ending,the best part was it was thick with dust and had a smashed pane of glass in,now that was dangerous as well as obviously unchecked,very surprised it went on and he'd caught me on the last 3 films I bought,put me off buying as he's obviously not the dealer he used to be, i gave the film away.the only good thing is he is now using a collector to sell films for him and they are checked,very poor service and a rogue,Mark

Mark,

are you willing to name the culprit as he seems like one to avoid !!

David,
I'm going to say no at this time but I'm not alone in being turned over by him ,such as shame greed takes over,Mark

yes i have to say,now you mention it, that in the past i have received films that stink of storage age, when i take it out of the box the film is covered in dirt but even worse, mould,this has happened more than once. (but not from CHC) Although we have a laugh at some of the non collectors on ebay, i guess when they state untested,they are at least being honest there, the funny bit is when they then follow that up with,"but looks to be in great condition, then put a start price up for the equivalent of a good feature.
Are these clowns better or worse than people/dealers within the hobby selling crap being passed as good condition?

It seems almost pointless to me Tom, for a dealer to send out known rubbish.
9 times from 10 it would almost certainly result in a boomerang effect and at considerable expense considering most dealers almost always prefer to send goods out with tracking in place to protect themselves.

Of course it would be the same for the paying customer returning the goods, so who then eventually finishes up at least £20 out of pocket?

I know it goes on sometimes that people do end up disappointed by things being not as described, but I cannot understand why all prints aren't first verified and then why a 100% honest description isn't offered at the point of sale even if the initial advertisement for the goods is a little sketchy.

This would surely guarantee a greater overall profitability for any dealer by the fact hardly anything then would qualify for return.

Prints with faults will always still sell, just not for the price expected for near perfect ones.
There are many that don't mind far less than perfect prints so long as the price is right as a result.

The thing that I've experienced that personally I dislike, is when you are offered a part refund for when things are far less than expected from initial description.
It's a bit of a cop out to my mind for not just actually advertising it correctly in the first instance and can waste a lot of collectors time.

Last films I bought from CHC was not very good at all ... I didn’t mention this to him at the time, I probably should have

I think for the sake of all customers, it is always a good idea to mention any dissatisfaction even if you still prefer to keep the goods as it is too much hassle to return them in many instances.

The reason I say this is simply to not allow anyone to creep into the habit of thinking it is acceptable to continually send out shoddy goods.
If they do this to one customer and get away with it without any complaint, it could easily inadvertently encourage more of the same in the future to that same customer and worse still, to other customers who would never accept this kind of activity.

We all want our titles I know, but surely it isn't always best to adopt the mindset that anything is better than nothing, certainly not at full price anyhow.

All anyone really wants, is to know exactly what it is they are buying and for there to be little by way of disappointment when the goods arrive with us all.
If things are described accurately, better still with a few screenshots to accompany them, there should be no reason for anyone to ever be left hugely disappointed.

I'd like to think for any films that I may ever sell, no one could ever say that they didn't receive an honest and very full assessment of what it is that they are buying.

Steve Osborne is a gem, his customer service is perfect. I bought a 16mm 9 To 5 which was sold as slight fade. First and third reels were not bad, but the second was red with extremely low sound. Got a full refund and to keep the print. First class, if every dealer was like him, it would be a dream to shop films

hi vidar am I a gem also

I know some dealers just look at the first few feet and if it looks ok then thay say the whole film is good.no one can tell by that many films have scratches at any point .its s difficult buying films as not many view first as i do .always

I've never dealt with Steve to date Vidar, but I must admit I never hear anything other than good things said of him.

I must be missing out I suppose but it has been a while since I have imported any film as the cost of it since the dollar grew stronger again becomes astronomical at times here.
I must get onto his mailing list though, there may be much simply too good to miss out on.

Does he send out regular lists?

Nigels films are ones I watch out for and it is reassuring to hear he checks everything front to back before advertising it.
If I didn't already have A Wizard Of Oz, I'd be bidding!!

Thanks andrew the wizard of oz print is nice i hope it goes to a good home i dont collect 8mm but if i did id keep it.now wizard of oz 16mm no theres a thing.

That's a shame when dealers deface boxes with labels or permanent markers.

The sales lists from Steve Osborne at the The Reel Image seem to be issued about every three months. The highly sought-after items
go very, very quickly. Often times, by the time you get the list in the mail, many items are already spoken for. That said, I have gotten some really nice stuff from him. I am almost certain the sales lists are free. To subscribe to sales list mailings I think you can simply contact Steve at: thereelimage_043@yahoo.com

He also publishes a quarterly small format booklet "The Reel Image" by paid subscription which has articles, letters and photos etc.
Steve and his wife Natalie are ethical, honest sellers and great to deal with. Here is a pic of a recent issue of the Reel Image (note Keith Wilton in middle right):