The spoon or screwdriver to the ear tip, is invaluable advice here from Paul.
It may sound nuts but is a completely valid and time honoured method of solving issues with wearing components like bearings and gears etc.

Besides highly technical methods of identifying issues with mechanical rotating components in industry using B.A.V.A. etc..
This method is still used, valued and is highly effective in identifying exactly where the problem is originating from.

I did try grease, but no difference. Also did the spoon listening method, which was amazing! Really pretty cool - but as I'm not sure what to listen for, still not sure what's wrong....

I will try to attach a video, the first part is with projector in forward, then in reverse.

Thanks for all your help so far! Repair will probably end up being the only option, which will have to wait - Philadelphia is a seven hour drive...

Here (I hope!) is the Vimeo link:

https://vimeo.com/224234040

Cannot view it right now Michael, but will study once home thanks.
I'm sure you won't have too much to concern yourself by at this point with your GS.

Once you're placing film through it, that of course opens up an entire new can of worms. 😊😊

All part of life's rich tapestry so far as this crazy hobby of ours is concerned! 😊

Ok Michael, I have had my GS back off to listen for something similar to your noise, and my conclusion is because it sounds like metal to metal "tick tick tick " it is coming from the cam that rotates and moves the fork in and out and down to advance the film through the gate. Get a torch and look toward the shutter and look to see if any grease is here at all, and using the described method with the wood/screwdriver place it close to the cluster of screws and frame in that area just above the flywheel. I have a theory on the reason it sounds noisy going forward and not in reverse, I think all the grease has been pushed in one direction, so when you place it in reverse the grease is backed up the other side of the of the cam lobe?. If you open the GS up on the control side it has a swing out gate, rotate the shutter by hand in the forward motion, fork moving downward and make sure this is not hitting any side of the gate, it should clear the slot to one side of the gate and not hit anywhere, perhaps someone has tried to adjust this and miss adjusted this, certainly don't put any film through it until you have at least checked this, you don't need any mechanical knowledge of the GS to see this, just a bright light and a magnifying glass.

Very interesting Paul, I've just had a look (and another listen with my wooden spoon) and it does seem like the shutter might be slightly rubbing against a piece of metal when run in forward (I'll have to refer to the service manual tomorrow, I've downloaded it to my office computer). When I turn the shutter by hand it is not rubbing, but seems to be when the forward switch is on.

Might have to tear it down a bit from the control side to verify, which seems pretty daunting! But, at least I have a solid lead!

Thanks so much! Not sure what the fix might be, but for right now just focused on finding out what exactly is making the noise.

Oddly enough, my st1200 belt broke a few days ago, just ordered a replacement - so completely out of super 8 for the moment!

Michael, I have watched your short video now thanks and it does indeed sound like a metallic noise of something intermittently touching something that it shouldn't in forwards projection mode.

As you suspect it may be the shutter, have you tried placing a straight bladed flat screwdriver of medium size to the rotating worm etc to see if by moving the end float on this shaft all to the free end while the projector is running in forwards projection mode, whether or not then the noise can be made to disappear?

This will prove your theory to be correct or otherwise if you can lever on just the correct part of the shaft.

Andrew, I hope I am not annoyingly daft, but I'm not sure what you mean by moving the end float?

I think you mean push the tip of the screwdriver against the claw assembly while moving in forward to see if the noise disappears? That might be a worthwhile start before I attempt to tear down the other side of the machine. Maybe I just need to bend the claw assembly a little bit? (Item (1) in first picture)

No Michael, certainly not the claw or anything else that reciprocates,.. that would be disastrous!!

No, I was simply suggesting if there is a leverage nip point that you can prise the shaft to move a fraction towards the free end of the shaft, like a gear hub etc etc, then you would be able to tell for certain whether or not it is two metallic objects touching each other in forward run mode, that shouldn't ordinarily.

Ahhhhh..makes sense! I'll give it a shot tonight!

Thanks so much!

Are the two springs there Michael, and attached correctly?, I would imagine any excessive wear here would be amplified if these aren't attached or present at all, failing this the claw wear is excessive, that looks like a tricky little job if that has to be dismantled.

I'll take a look tonight to see if the springs are there....thanks!

Well, crap. Anyone looking to buy a GS1200?

It's the shutter blades, rubbing against a big metal piece behind the gate. Very thin metal blades (3 blade shutter). So, thinking I could just bend them a hair in the opposite direction, I have now succeeded in reproducing the sound in forward AND reverse!

Ok, so now you know what the problem actually is, can you get in there to adjust each one individually with the cover off, if as you say there is little room to move, perhaps one blade is twisted just clipping the plate. Just fix a marker, pencil / screwdriver at a point horizontal to the shutter blades to gauge each position, then carefully adjust each one to the same position to clear it both sides, should not take too long rotating by hand. Another tricky job to do, plus you would have to position the 3 blades correctly on the shaft for flicker if you tried to remove it and straighten. I would try and do it in situ first Michael, someone has messed with it for some reason. Maybe easier to access this from the lamp housing side, that way you can see which blade is clipping the metal plate, and then you can carefully adjust a bit at a time ..........

Michael, I personally wouldn't be inclined to "bend" anything to make the noise disappear.

I cannot second guess what the reason(s) for the shutter blades catching may be, but what I do know is something along the length of that shutter shaft must either have worn, is missing, or has been put back incorrectly (possibly in the wrong position) at some time or another.

Without having the machine in front of me, it is virtually impossible to spot these subtleties, but you have the assembly drawings there so with some time and patience, you should be able to work out what is wrong hopefully.

Often the shutter shaft has some end float adjustment and thrust washer(s) etc etc to allow this.
This can and probably will affect penetration of the claw also as the cam lobe is often affixed to the same shaft.
All of these issues will be addressed virtually at once, once the shaft "finds" it's natural and correctly designed position in my experiences with these things, so far as penetration depth is concerned.

You should however find that once the shutter shaft is "centred" correctly in its axial position, if penetration depth is "off the mark" slightly, a separate adjuster at the claw fulcrum is also provided by the designers to allow fine tuning of the claw depth once the shaft is running clockwise and anti-clockwise, without the shutter blades catching any component or any part of the machines framework.

Michael

Andrew has certainly put his finger on the problem and I can definitely tell you its the shutter, I had exactly the same problem, just slightly bend the blades away so they don't catch, or even better would be to invest on having a 2 bladed shutter fitted this is far better and will give you more light on the screen

David perhaps you should have piped in earlier if you can "definitely " tell Michael what the problem is, please read all the uploaded info, before you make such a wide sweeping remark, there was no definite answer, but a gradual checking of something it might be. My view of the shutter going forward and in reverse, appears to show this motor spinning in the same direction, ruling out end float movement going one way and then the other. I hope Michael is able to fix this GS because if he has to dismantle it to every piece on the table and then can't put in back together again, not amount of help here "will put humpty back together again ". I don't advocate bending the shutter blades in order to eliminate the noise, but just to determine if one or more are out of true to each other as they connected to the shaft on a brass feral and locked in position on by a grub screw, if by moving one or more it corrects the noise without any serious dismantling of the machine itself, especially if your not as confident as some on here to take on the task, then I for one would do just that and no more, because if its moving backward or forward due to wear it will be hitting all three blades and not just one.

Fair enough Paul I wont say another word on this forum and leave everything to you

Good bye everyone

Its all yours now Paul !!

Vidar

Please remove me from this forum

David, everyone's input is valued and appreciated here whenever anyone has an issue.
It is only through collective valuable past experience that a true picture can be formed to give useful information back to whoever may be experiencing an issue.
I hope you decide after some thought, not to leave this forum.

A truly childish attitude to take. As Andrew clearly points out, experience's of others imparted to someone on here who's having a problem is the only way to keep the costs down on these ageing machines, I'm no bloody expert and don't pretend to be, but if can help someone I will chip in, a difference of opinion is water off a ducks back to me, I am very thick skinned............., call me anything you want, but not early in the morning........

You don't have to be insulting Paul its not being childish just trying to be helpful as I had a gs1200 with exactly the same problem

I agree 100% to what Andrew just wrote and I hope you reconsider, David. We need to keep a positive tone here and concentrate on helping each other and motivate all of us to add whatever could be helpful. We need all of you here with the combined experience. All of us here are very different persons with one common passion, and the written language is stronger than we often think about when we write things. Keep this in mind and be kind to each other.

I haven't added anything here as I have no experience that could help you, Michael, but I sure read what the others write to learn something myself, especially since I have a GS-1200 myself and I don't want any new type of noise from it :-) I hope it will sort out. The GS-1200 seems quite complex inside. I haven't dared (or needed) to operate much on it. My Eumig 810D is so much simpler inside.

And it was helpful David as I am certain Michael agrees given he "liked" your input.
Paul has vast amounts of experience with these machines also I believe,
so Both of your inputs here are highly valued and very very welcomed.

If anything,we need more people's thoughts and experiences shared here for when somebody is having an issue with a piece of equipment, I'd say.

I do sincerely appreciate everyone's input and advice! Sadly, after spending the afternoon yesterday fiddling with the shutter blades, can't seem to correct the problem (or get it back to the original problem - the sound is now in foward and reverse). I looked at some threads dealing with replacing the shutter, but that seems a bit above my capability. So, instead of taking a sledgehammer to the thing, I calmly put the covers back on, and will get it serviced with 2 blade shutter installed.

On a brighter note, my belt for the ST1200 came I yesterday. Put the GS underneath the workbench, spent 3 minutes replacing the belt, called for my 4 year old to come downstairs, and we spent the rest of the night watching films. God bless my ST I guess!

I'll see about shipping the GS to Philadelphia, I could then pick it up on my way to CineSea in October!

David I apologise to you, it was not intended as an insult but to just read from the beginning the upload from Michael, both myself and Andrew were trying to figure what it could be causing the problem, at that time none of us knew what it was, if you had read this and then made your comment of having as GS with the same problem it would have saved a lot time and quite a lot of misunderstanding, no offence was intended .