RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#26 by Jacob Delaney , Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:34 am

How about Tetrachloroethylene/perchloroethylene (dry cleaning fluid)? They use that stuff in "wet gate" film printing. Here's Kodak's recommended list for solvents: http://motion.kodak.com/motion/Support/P...Use/solvent.htm


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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#27 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Mon Nov 23, 2015 11:12 pm

Jacob, with all due respesct, I do not wish to unleash these chemics on my films, Kodak is not infallible, it gave us a film
structure that was not solid in foundation of colour spectrum, so I have no faith in any of their recommendations, one of theirs
was a cleaner that ruined some film stock, so I do not trust them,they are not to be trusted, they are the same folk that gave
Derek Simmonds support on film stripe. LIKE HELL THEY DID, the twats.



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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#28 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Mon Nov 23, 2015 11:31 pm

On film cleaners lubricants, let me just say, 2.22 was THE BEST of them all, THERMOFILM at the same time was as good, period 1970's
henceforth the stuff has declined, 2.22 got thinner, Thermofilm became like Eue De Cologne, no sooner on than gone, SHIT in other
words. All I ask is a lubricant that lets film go through a projector, a nice steady picture, it might even have the addition of a bit
of scratch cover, like the aforementioned used to do, before the EU regulations stepped in. I remember the horror stories of how
certain film cleaners etc robbed film of colour, This is not true, if any film soaked in a solution it is bound to have an effect.
Myself, I still use WD40. it has had no affect on my film , it is a wipe,only a very steady image on screen.



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Last edited Mon Nov 23, 2015 11:32 pm | Top

RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#29 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Mon Nov 23, 2015 11:52 pm

As a rider to my comments above, try your film lube of choice against WD40, it is as good as your Filmguard, and a helluva
lot cheaper. I for one will not on common sense pay £50.00 for a Quart of Filmguard, it doesn't have the qualities of 2.22
there are no treatments that have the capabilities, it is another rip off.



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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#30 by Mats Abelli , Tue Nov 24, 2015 6:49 pm

Hugh! Have you been using WD40 for a long time? Just want to be shure that the films will not be ruined after a couple of years. Have somebody on this forum used the cleaner/lubricant that is sold by CHC?


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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#31 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:07 pm

Hi Mats, well a few years on 16mm, to no ill effect, the pictures haven't fallen off or anything drastic, I don't immerse it, just a wipe
to cut friction, resulting in nice steady projection. I have just started using on 8mm, indeed there are quite a few collectors using
it, on the other forum it was popular. I know that various collectors favour different forms of treatment, even Silicone or furniture
polish, I can understand this, the lubricants/ cleaners that have been offered, some proved to be disastrous to films of certain stock.
Personally, I favoured FilmRenew, it can no longer be imported into the UK, strangely, one of the members of the Urbanski forum
said he had devised a film lube akin to FilmRenew at a fraction of the cost, he was banned! Another reason why I distrust all this
malarkey about "What a great product it is", I'll wager that it costs very little to make, and that includes them all, yet they set a high
price for what is essentially a grease, so I am happy with WD40, I believe it is supposed to melt plastic, a lot of my films are on plastic spools, they haven't been harmed in any way. I liked Cresclene, priced reasonably, but can't be sent through the mail, so another
loser for me.



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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#32 by Mats Abelli , Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:15 pm

I bought a bottle from Phil, when visiting Blackpool last weekend. It was sucessfully brought to Norway in my checked in luggage, so I will try it on some of my oldest ( 60+ )prints. They are in good condition, but I guess some lubricating wouldn´t hurt. I also have some bottles of the original Kodak cleaner on the shelf, but haven´t tried it yet. Seems that it just cleans the prints.


 
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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#33 by Mats Abelli , Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:16 pm

Have you tried WD40 on magnetic stripes, Hugh?


 
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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#34 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:17 pm

Mats. hold off on the Kodak stuff, do some net research, Cresclene is superb.



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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#35 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:23 pm

Hi Mats, I have, so far so good, but it is early days for me, DON'T try it on your films yet, I will let you know of my findings.
On the unstriped 8mm & 16MM, fine.



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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#36 by Mats Abelli , Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:34 pm

Then I will use Cresclene on my films with magnetic stripes.



 
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Last edited 11.25.2015 | Top

RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#37 by Andrew Woodcock , Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:36 pm

The number one consideration now on any film cleaner is not so much how well the cleaner cleans the films. I've found plenty do that job well enough.

It's more a concern to me as to what cleaner and lubricant is actually totally safe to use on ALL magnetic striped films.
The pasted striped ones can all too easily be completely ruined for good!
Be very careful what you put on these.

I haven't used Cresclean so I cannot comment on that one but if Hugh recommends it, I'm sure it's absolutely fine.
I can say that filmguard is equally fine on all Film kinds and I also like the smoothness in which the films glide through the gate with much reduced noise levels.

I stick by filmguard simply because it does everything I want a cleaner and lubricant to do.



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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#38 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:37 pm

Hi Mats, Cresclene is the best of any, it won't harm your films in any way.



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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#39 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Wed Nov 25, 2015 8:04 pm

I agree Andrew, but I think that there is this myth that there is no other remedy than someone who declares a film cleaner/lube
with a logo etc, sometimes the answer can be found in our own backyard so to speak, why else would a contributor be banned from a site that is founded on a film restorative, simply because money is involved, I have long since left the notion that pro film lube/cleaners
are good for archival film, the 35/70mm film was junked after a SHORT RUN, yes, a SHORT RUN, yet they ladle out the mantra, "the pro's
use it, yes for 12 MONTHS!, that is meaningless to us, we archive film. Here's a parable from Scott, many years back, I watched a documentary on TV about a poor woman in Africa, her child was slowly dying from Dysentery, the local Pharmacy were quite happy
to take this poor woman's hard earned pay to give her their cure, THE WELLCOME DRUGS CO., I have avoided them since, which for weeks had no effect, still she gave her hard earned money,
to no good, her child was dying, she consulted the local "witch doctor", who prescribed Molasses, from cane sugar, which cured the kid,
which says it all, sometimes a cure is on your doorstep. So don't believe the crap you are given by these "experts", all to often, a far
cheaper and as good remedy is in your hands.



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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#40 by David Ollerearnshaw , Wed Nov 25, 2015 10:11 pm

Agree Hugh. Tea Tree Oil is another ancient one. I used it when on holiday in Thailand for bites worked wonders and kept the mossies away too. Don't think I would use Molasses on my films, still it might work like protect a print leader.


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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#41 by Andrew Woodcock , Wed Nov 25, 2015 11:04 pm

HUgh , I've no doubt I am paying way over what I ought to be to achieve the results I desire from a film cleaner.
If I didn't spend half my time off doing things like watching films, repairing or maintaining projectors etc etc, I'm certain I would find a cheaper and equally viable alternative.

As things stand, I am happy, yet again to pay over the odds perhaps for a product I know and trust. It's expensive, but then isn't every aspect of this hobby at times?

I am far happier paying for Filmguard from Jack Roe or Paul Foster than I ever am for the price we are forced to pay for Beaulieu spares.
The projector is worth every penny but you know you are paying through the eyes and nose for these given the monopoly on them.

It's just the way it is, I find, this late time around in the hobby for me.



 
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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#42 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Wed Nov 25, 2015 11:17 pm

I appreciate your view point Andrew, and as you know, I know you are the "business" on your favoured projector, my only
"beef" is this overcharge on a simple treatment for film preservation/lubrication. It is obvious to me that in real terms, a
tanker of this stuff could be bought cheap. I stand by my previous statements, Filmguard and all its equivalents are overpriced
by a lot. I will never be swayed by collectors and how good a certain treatment is, the Thermofilm mob proved that, suckers to a man.
No, all I ask is friction reduction, but not silicone, WD40 is fish oil based, and a lot cheaper.



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Last edited Wed Nov 25, 2015 11:21 pm | Top

RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#43 by Andrew Woodcock , Wed Nov 25, 2015 11:46 pm

Agreed Hugh, I don't doubt your word for one moment. I am just too lazy and often too busy to ever find these things out.
That's what I love about forums. Can you imagine just how long it would take nowadays to gain a suitable knowledge base on this hobby without forums?

The people like yourself and Maurice over on the other forum are priceless to new collectors nowadays!

You couldn't possibly learn anywhere near as much anywhere else than studying previous forum posts from all the guys and gals who have been at it for years. Janice is another great example of what I'm talking about here.



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RE: Safe or not ... Film cleaners?

#44 by Hugh Thompson Scott ( deleted ) , Fri Nov 27, 2015 8:34 pm

Thanks Andrew for those very kind, but undeserved words, I wouldn't recommend anything that I thought would in any way or form
harm film, I have used WD40, on 16mm, for a few years now, it is a lubricant, it has had no bad effect on my films, on striped early days,
DON'T use it yet on striped film, I'll let you know my findings. I still think that the film lubricants are vastly over priced, I'd use Vaseline rather than pay for this stuff. Indeed, the claim of scratch removal by Filmguard is laughable, they say to use it in a film bath, wetgate,
Turpentine would give the same result, a con if ever there was. The stuff from Phil at CHC is a great product, but how the hell does he get it out there?



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